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  Q&A | Fibromyalgia General Discussion | Fibromyalgia is totally beatable

Welcome, guest
Name: TonyS. Title of Question: Fibromyalgia is totally beatable
Question: Hi guys. Just wanted to let you know I beat my fibromyalgia completely. Its just a name.....that is all. There is no medical or scientific definition on why or how it is, and that is exactly how you should look at it. Look at it as nothing, because it isnt. Email me, and Ill tell you how I beat mine. You need to be prepared for lots of raw foods, and absolutely no meat, dairy, processed foods, or anything of that nature. You will not be able to eat any cooked food for atleast 90 days, as well. Be ready for lots of salads with 20+ ingredients. You will drink nothing but water and fresh juices during that time, as well. (you need a juicer, and be able to get to the store for fresh fruit, and veggies) This is real, and its all you need to beat this condition for good. Anthony  ?

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Name: JoniB | Date: January 16, 2008, 23:44
Answer: What works for you may not work for everyone. I will not consider my fibromyalgia as "nothing." It has robbed me of so much and I have had to make so many adjustments in my life as well as acceptance. It is a big deal for those suffering from all the symptoms including chronic pain, fibro fog and fatigue! If your diet was a cure all, why don't the Dr.'s know about it? I'm glad it workes for you. Getting to the store frequently for fresh fruit & veggies would be difficult as well as spending time washing and preparing 20+ ingredients for a meal! I can't imagine not eating hot/cooked food for 90 days especially during the cold winter months. Adding more fruits and veggies to a diet and eating healthier is a good idea. I have read from a different website that eating tomatoes or citrus is bad for fibro. Anyone considering this diet or any other should check with their Dr. first and about having the proper vitamins/nutrients that are needed. Sorry Anthony, but I believe that having professional skepticism is a good thing.  =

Name: TonyS. | Date: January 16, 2008, 23:53
Answer: Im so glad you said check with a doctor. My question to you is, why would you check with a doctor? They will not help, in any form. They have no way. Do you want to beat this? Then you make it to the store. You find ways to beat it. If you want to be sick, then do it. You are ill informed, on so many levels, that you will never beat this disease, in your mindset. Im looking for people who want to beat this. VITAMIN LEVELS WILL BE HIGHER THAN YOU HAVE HAD YOUR ENTIRE LIFE. Do NOT listen to naysayer, doctor lovers. Email me, and Ill give you my personal phone, so we can talk. And, yes. What worked for me WILL work for everyone. Everyone. Its been proven.  =

Name: TonyS. | Date: January 17, 2008, 0:01
Answer: This is not a "diet", by the way. Diets are for the weak, and unable. This is a way of life, period. This is why I said what is expected of you, in my very first post. Your "professionalism" matters none. As a matter of fact, medicinal training of any kind has no place here.  =

Name: JoniB | Date: January 17, 2008, 7:51
Answer: diet [ˈdaiət] noun food, especially a course of recommended foods, for losing weight or as treatment for an illness etc. I must say that I disagree with you on many levels. It is a diet! Also, if we are to cut out dairy, etc., we still need vitamin D and calcium. In fact many with fibro have low levels of vit. D. My Dr. recommends 1,000 IU per day for me and calcium helps it to absorb. Some need more iron or B vitamins. Checking with a Dr. first is not only necessary but wise! I am NOT ill informed. I have done research on this illness/disorder (not a disease) for over a decade and will continue. I pray for more awareness and advancement in the medical technology field to beat this disorder, or at least for better control of it. You don’t know me; my mindset or that I do want to be better. You are pushing your Diet onto others that may not be right for everyone. I am an optimistic person overall but when someone comes on here to play “God” with a cure all, it is better to gather all the facts that will be safe for the individual. If this Diet is proven, please show me where I can read this information besides what your beliefs are. Being “professional” about research for fibromyalgia does matter. Do not take advice that could possibly be more harmful than good. Do the research. Continue to have hope/faith for wellness, but be leery (skeptic) of the “cure all” for this disorder! Medicinal training should Not be overlooked! Remember if it sounds too good to be true, it usually is.  =

Name: TonyS. | Date: January 17, 2008, 14:37
Answer: Ive done all the research possible. This condition will not be cured by doctors, or drugs, ever. Sorry to say it. Again, its not a diet. Diets come with the assumption that you will eventually sway from them, and go back to doing the things you did before. Yes, it will work everyone. By the way vitamin D in milk is not absorbed well by the body. If you are going to drink milk, it has to be organic, and unpasteurized/homogenized. In the 1800's there was a "milk diet" that helped people beat arthritis, and other diseases. This was raw, unprocessed milk. It didn't work 100%, because the other components were not there. If we were all getting so much calcium from milk, then why do we get osteoporosis? My grandmother has it, and she drinks milk everyday of her life. Your body has no calcium, so it starts taking it from your bones.....this is osteoporosis. You are heading in the wrong direction by praying for a cure. Im all for praying, but not for cures in a pill form. There won't be one. MD's know medicine, not nutrition and true health. They prescribe drugs to treat symptoms, not cure diseases. I know this is big for people with this condition. I HAD IT FOR 5 YEARS. Im not "pushing" anything. Do you want to beat this, yes or no? Its understandable that there is skepticism, because we were taught to run to doctors when we're ill. You are breaking a lifelong habit, in more ways than one. You don't have to listen to me. Again, Im looking for individuals who want to learn how to beat fibro. In the very least, you need to buy "Achieving great health", by bob macauley. Im not doing this for any other reason but to help you guys out.  =

Name: Debra4Real | Date: January 18, 2008, 4:33
Answer: Hello: What a great topic..I think that anything to the extreme can be very hard on you and if you are going to make any changes you need to take it one step at a time..Fibromyalgia has taken the qualitly of my life away from me and many others out here..Its not that easy to just jump ahead full force when you cannot even get out of bed..But, you can try to atleast change your diet so that youre not eating to much sugar and fats.Eat more fruits and veggies if you cannot eat them raw then lightly steam them..I drink rice milk and find that its not that bad once you get use to it..I still will have my muchies but i have learned to cut down on them and let me tell you that was really hard to do..When your in so much pain it seems that we turn to the wrong food for comfort but then suffer more after feeling quilty for it and sad when we hit the scales..Then our weight becomes more of an issue and our body hurts more and more because of the extra pounds and bad choices of food...When i eat something thats bad for me i feel so good at that moment with a smile on my face..After that i feel like hell and know that i will pay for it and i have..We all want to live a healthy and happy life but it takes allot of willpower and strenght to push to get through this horrible dark cloud..Good support is key but when you dont have someone to help you get motivated when your so ill all the time then its really hard to do alone..No one should push you to anything ..Your friends and family should help you with your choices if your not strong enough to do it youre self..Its o.k. to be you and affaid of change...I really think that all of you here are very brave and you not your doctor or anyone else knows whats best for you and your health..This is not a one size fits all because we are all different but we all are suffering and need to keep on going until we find what helps us best to make it through..Do something everyday to make you smile no matter what it is because you deserve so much for all the pain and suffering that you go through every day..Take care of you because you are and will always be no#1....One day at a time and one step at a time and you will make it and feel like your self once again.Good luck to all of you whatever your choices are...keep strong...Lov Deb  =

Name: TonyS. | Date: January 18, 2008, 13:28
Answer: You said it deb. I relies on the person, and their ability. But, you can change. Everyone can change. Its ok to be skeptical, and afraid, it almost seems to be human nature to be scared, but you don't have to be. And yes, you cannot simply change everything overnight. I had severe dextoxification symptoms when I switched my diet over quickly, and went from a bad diet, to a perfect diet. I got rashes, felt weaker than ever, was always thirsty, and had slight vertigo some days. These were good things, and that is how I looked at it. It meant my body was kicking out everything it didn't want, and I was finally allowing it to heal. I would stop eating red meat, fish, and chicken asap. Id stay away from everything white as well. White breads, processed sugars, white rice, milk, etc. Get your family/friends/neighbors to go to the store for you. You'll only have to go 1-2 times a week, depending on how much you eat. Have them stock you up on fruits/veggies, and everything has be fresh. You can premake salads, and put them all in seperate containers, so they are ready. You can have someone do that for you to, 1-2 times a week. You need sprouts. I can't stress that enough. It is work sprouting them, but they are 20-50 times stronger in the vitamins/enzymes, than thier full grown counterparts. Stick with "superfoods" (do a google search) and sprout things like broccoli, alfalfa, mung beans, sunflower seeds, wheatgrass.. Sprouts are very strong, no matter the seed. You need 1-2 gallons of water a day. Forget about soft drinks, alcohol, canned/bottled juices. I would buy a masticating juicer as soon as you can. I have an omega 8003. You should try to get a liter of fresh juice a day. Try to make most of it carrot, and incorporating apples/pears/oranges makes it less intense. Finally, you need organic spirulina and chlorella. Its the superfood of all superfoods, and has the highest concentration of vitamins/minerals/enzymes of any plant known, currently. Use baby steps as motivation, and as you feel better, do more. You arent going to get better overnight, which is what deters most people, I think. Be patient, eat living foods, and let your body heal. Try to incorporate relaxation and deep breathing exercises. You can do google searches and find techniques for these. To quote shakespeare, "What wound did ever heal but by gentle degrees?" Give it time, and know you are doing the right thing.  =

Name: TonyS. | Date: January 18, 2008, 13:37
Answer: http://www.newstarget.com/011701.html Read this article. I know, I know, its about cancer., but all the properties of the article are there, for every condition. Move away from doctors and pharmaceuticals, and toward whats real. I especially like his comments on the fact that hospitals serve cancer causing foods, instead of cancer fighting foods. So true.  =

Name: JJ1 | Date: January 19, 2008, 20:28
Answer: My niece was a vegan, no meat or dairy or egg or anything from an animal (but she would wear leather and cotton, go figure). She was careful to get essential nutrients while on this diet (and yes, what you eat is your "DIET", so yes, TonyS, you are suggesting a diet). My niece saw no miraculous health changes, got just as sick as the next person, and ended up going back to a vegetarian diet that allows animal products and now will even eat meat. She looks and feels much healthier than she ever did on the vegan diet. To each his own, but on such drastic diets that eliminate essential food groups, special care must be taken to ensure proper nutrition. Your diet becomes your life.  =

Name: lmb2 | Date: January 20, 2008, 16:46
Answer: I totally agree w/ JoniB here... tony you are right that doctor's can't "cure" fibro though, because there is no cure, only treatments. If the DIET worked for you, then you were probably MISDIAGNOSED as having fibro in the first place.... i don't believe it for a second LOL... Fibro is definitely not nothing, and if you really think that, then again, you never had fibro in the first place because a real sufferer knows how REAL it is!! your diet is ridiculous and would deprive ppl of so many much needed nutrients.....  =

Name: skidoo | Date: January 20, 2008, 17:28
Answer: Tony, I hope your disdain for the medical community doesn't come back and bite you one day. Like when you really need a doctor. Good luck.  =

Name: TonyS. | Date: January 20, 2008, 19:09
Answer: What nutrients would it deprive you of? Why is it so ridculous? You laugh as this is a joke, but if you were truly sick, youd be looking for all options. Food groups, as you know them, are a joke. Leave it at that.You need to know nutrition, and how your body is using the things you put into it. You don't need red meat, or milk, or anything from either of these. Where are all these "nutrients" coming from on a cooked food, processed diet, and how are you getting them, in the real quantities you need? You need 30,000IU of Beta-carotene a day. Where are you getting this from? If you are going to claim that its missing nutrients, and not healthy, you need to be able to back that up. Your body will be introduced to vitamins/minerals thats its never even seen before. The fact is, there are only a few things that can make the human body ill. Bacteria, viruses, an acidic environment in the body (low ph), a lack of certain vitamins, a mixture of those, etc. Genetics doesn't play a part, and you aren't sick by "chance". You don't have fibro by mistake, or by a "luck of the draw". Again, im sorry. But it doesnt work like that. Your daily diet, and a diet, are two different things, as you know them. You guys go on "diets", I don't. I eat perfectly, and have had multiple tests done to prove my vitamin/mineral/essential acids are ok, because I was worried about the same thing, in the beginning. Not only are they ok, they are off the charts. Why do (good) oncologists take cancer patients off of red meat, pork, and dairy, when they have cancer? Because it spikes certain proteins, and feeds the disease. Imagine what its doing to you, when you are "healthy". Its creating an acidic environment, that allows disease to thrive, and gives it every opportunity to do so. Im still more than open for emails for anyone else who wants to know how to be healthy, btw. I don't hate the medical community. They have a place. Things like stopping bleeding and closing up wounds, things of that nature. Your body can take care of the rest, if allowed. As far as a "vegetarian diet" goes, if you are heating your foods above 105 degrees, (every cooking form does this) you are removing ALL enzymes, and a good chuck of the vitamins and minerals. The parts you havent destroyed by heating, are unstable, and your body has a very hard time trying to digest, and use them properly. Your body reacts to these cooked meals, as if it were under attack by a virus or bacteria, and your immune system releases white blood cells in massive amounts, trying to combat what it thinks is an outside invader. Thats digestive leukocytosis, and you should be very concerned with it. It puts major strain on your entire system, and happens everytime you eat a cooked meal, no matter if its VEGGIES OR NOT. Guess what? Raw foods, in their natural state, do not cause this. Your body loves them, and knows exactly what to do with them, effortlessly. The strain on your immune system is lifted, and you're allowing it to worry about other things, including getting rid of builtup toxins and viruses, and stabilizing your bodies ph. WHY DONT DOCTORS TELL YOU THAT? I could go on forever here, but again, im looking for people who want to help themselves. These individuals have already made up thier mind.  =

Name: lmb2 | Date: January 20, 2008, 20:06
Answer: haha ok....... i do not have fibromyalgia because of what i eat.... i developed it after a horrible fall down the stairs where i injured my back/shoulder and it triggered it... and a lot of people get it after things like car accidents and stuff. there are a lot of things that can cause/trigger it.. and there are not only 3 things that can make a person ill. you keep referring to cancer, but ummmm cancer is not caused by bacteria, virus or low ph, so....... "leave it at that" lol... also you say we should be concerned about digestive leukocytosis, but that was a study done by a scientist in the 1920's. much more recent scientists have tried to prove his theory with NO luck and have found that it was probably the findings of an experimental error. here is a website on it http://www.beyondveg.com/tu-j--l/raw-cooked/raw-cooked-1i.shtml- . It also goes on to say that tests done now (with having more knowledge about the immune system and better technology than they did in the 1920's) show that as long as we eat some raw foods along with our cooked foods, our blood formula is not changed. also, raw food advocates ask others to prove the theory wrong, but when asked to prove it right, they have no evidence. i find this funny :) my point is, there is no miracle cure and our diet is not what is causing us to have fibromyalgia. I'm glad that this diet made you feel better , but it is not a cure!!!!  =

Name: TonyS. | Date: January 20, 2008, 20:22
Answer: This has nothing to do with "blood formula". Blood/urine ph is not body ph. Cancers are caused by what you have done to your body yourself. Things like chemicals from air, can be removed by your body. Fibro is simply things you have done to yourself. Like every other disease. Keep being sick. Keep putting names on things, and trying to find cures for them, that you'll never find. The raw food community does not have billions of dollars to prove things, to people who have no idea what health really is. We know its true, because we've CURED OURSELVES. Keep paying your doctors bills, and health insurance, so they can keep searching for things that dont exist.  =

Name: lmb2 | Date: January 20, 2008, 20:42
Answer: Oh my goodness... are you seriously that ignorant?? Now i'm upset.. how can you say that Cancer is something that people have done to their own bodies!! in the case of lung cancer, it possibly is, but other than that, that is such a crock of crap! what about babies who get cancer?? what if you get cancer one day? won't have much to say then would you? people do not give themselves cancer, especially the poor children. same goes for fibro.... i did not do anything to myself to cause this except where a big fluffy pair of slippers that made me fall down the stairs (still hate those slippers).... anyway, now your comments and opinions are getting very rude and completely uncalled for!  =

Name: TonyS. | Date: January 20, 2008, 20:43
Answer: You know what is laughable though. The fact that one person can have fibro from an accident, and the exact same thing can happen out of nowhere. They've explained nothing, and move further away from ridding the body of its issues. Chronic pain. Thanks. Its a double edged sword. They ask for answers, and I do too.  =

Name: TonyS. | Date: January 20, 2008, 20:49
Answer: How is this uncalled for? This is not ignorance, this is honesty, and truth.  =

Name: lmb2 | Date: January 20, 2008, 21:00
Answer: your comments about people doing things to their bodies to cause them to get cancer or fibro are completely wrong and uncalled for... so rude and impertinent toward the poor little children who have died of cancer, toward their parents and toward anyone else suffering from cancer or fibromyalgia! how awful to say that they did it to themselves!  =

Name: lmb2 | Date: January 20, 2008, 21:02
Answer: i am done here. so not arguing w/ a lost cause hippy from the 1920's!  =

Name: TonyS. | Date: January 20, 2008, 21:13
Answer: hahaha im 24 years old, dude. You guys need to get with the times. Babies can thank their parents for screwing up natural dna and fluids/proteins, and causing growth defects, infantile diabetes, and cancers in children. Im also done here. I hope you guys help yourselves, because you definately can.  =

Name: Turka | Date: January 20, 2008, 23:20
Answer: Tony, what is your e-mail address... I really would like to get in touch with you. I am like-minded.. and have no trust whatsoever in the medical profession on this. I am into vitamins, biochemistry... i have been doing an anti-oxidant therapy by Dr. Martin Pall.. it has been working but not enough.. I still have severe pain.. even tough my fatigue has gone down, I still have lots of energy swings.. severe pain.. let me know your e-mail adress!  =

Name: TonyS. | Date: January 20, 2008, 23:31
Answer: Turka. Mail anytime. anthony2610 AT gmail.com Im not discussing this anymore here, so direct everything to my email. (The "AT" is of course the symbol we use for email. Im leaving it out for spam reasons.)  =

Name: JJ1 | Date: January 21, 2008, 9:59
Answer: Tony, your belief that all illnesses are caused by environmental factors (or as you say, caused by what we do to our selves) shows your ignorance and totally discredits everything else you have stated.  =

Name: TonyS. | Date: January 21, 2008, 21:29
Answer: Im pain free, for life. You arent. Stop making this a contest.  =

Name: skidoo | Date: January 21, 2008, 22:28
Answer: A good percentage of the population is free from pain from fibromyalgia and they are NOT on your extreme diet. Sharing what helped you with fibromyalgia is generally welcomed by those in this forum, but coming in with a "I'm right and you all are wrong" attitude isn't going to get a friendly reception anywhere. We all want to get better, but it sounds like we have a little more common sense and a few more years of hard knocks to not fall for snake oil salesmen.  =

Name: TonyS. | Date: January 21, 2008, 23:56
Answer: Im not selling anything. Never will. Ask the 14 individuals who have mailed me, from this forum. Im pointing people in the right direction. Ok so people with fibro have pain, people without fibro have pain, people with nothing have pain. Open your eyes...... Im only here to get more people on board with FREE info to get healthy , forever. If they have been diagnosed and have no pain, then they are on pain killers. Talk about snake oil. Lets kill the pain, and offer no help, whatsoever. If not, then the pain is simply masked. Stop talking on this thread. I was diagnosed with fb, and infectious arthritis, in 2000. I spent 32K trying to get rid of pain, thorugh MD's. I can prove all of this. These guys are over the hill, and spend most of their time trying to pick apart anything outside of their comfort zone. Everyone stop posting here, and move on. Please.  =

Name: Wycklochness | Date: January 22, 2008, 6:12
Answer: Tony was only offering information on what worked for him, and that if you were interested you could e-mail him. Please read forums slowly and if they make you angry, don't respond straight away. Give it some time and read it again...slowly. Then if you feel that it is inappropriate, then reply. Remember we are all different ages, from different backgrounds, and dealing with FMS in varying degrees. This forum is meant to be helpful, and therefore we need to accept that what a person writes is how they feel. Tony I believe was feeling enthusiastic and just wanted to share his information with us. So please just relax and don't stress out because that can makes this FMS worse. Yes I hear you ..... but please take these forums on face value....we all gain something from them. No negativity. I felt after reading some of the comments, I needed to remind you all that its slowly, slowly. Cheers  =

Name: skidoo | Date: January 22, 2008, 8:12
Answer: You are selling your diet whether or not money is exchanged. I have no reason to doubt that your pain is gone and you believe it is due to your change in eating habits. I don't know if your pain was due to fibromyalgia nor do I know if it was the diet or some other lifestyle change that benefited you. If you are open minded, you know that your diet is not for everyone and having radical dietary changes like you suggest can cause more harm than good, especially when essential nutrients are eliminated. I would strongly recommend anyone who wishes to try this based on someones arbitrary internet claim to good health to consult a physician or nutritionist. Also be aware that a diet like this BECOMES YOUR LIFE. It is a full time job preparing food and ensuring that your intake of nutrients is proper. If you have a family and are responsible for their meals also, this could mean preparing conventional foods for them along with your own special diet. Just words of caution.  =

Name: skidoo | Date: January 22, 2008, 9:06
Answer: The Science Behind Raw Food, by Virginia Culler In the past few years, a new dietary trend has become popular. Raw foodism has hit the US, with a strong base and an ever-growing popularity. Raw foodists claim that a raw-food diet (which some define as as low as 70% uncooked foods, while others are exclusively [100%] raw) can boost overall health, increase energy, ameliorate disposition and physical appearance, and even cure many (sometimes terminal) diseases and ailments. However, the scientific community outside of the raw food community doesn't seem to see this diet in the same light as its followers. What is the science behind the raw food diet, and how much of what its advocates believe is true? Raw foodists base their practices on the theory that cooking food kills it, destroying its nutritional value (one source quotes that cooking destroys between 30 and 85% of food's nutritional values, (9)) and making it unhealthy and less easy to metabolize. Some raw foodists claim that all raw foods have large counts of enzymes, which are fundamental to human health and digestion and metabolization of food, and which are destroyed when food is heated to above 116 degrees Fahrenheit (8). One article even claims that cancer, heart disease and diabetes are all directly linked to the consumption of cooked foods (6). Another more specifically targets a chemical called acrylamide, which is found in plastics and is known to be carcinogenic, and was recently discovered to be present in high levels in many baked and fried foods (7), while raw (and boiled) foods showed no traces of the chemical. Yet another article goes further and points out that, aside from the dangers of acrylamide in many cooked starchy foods, it has been shown that meat cooked at high temperatures is contaminated by heterocyclic amines, or HCAs, which are also known to be carcinogenic. All in all, the raw food community online has provided many links to scientific articles backing up their theories and practices. Given all of these interesting scientific pro-raw foodism stances, I am still somewhat skeptical in my research. This is in part due to the fact that, when I was not navigating specifically from pro-raw foodism sites, I was unable to find many articles in favor of raw foodism, and none which were in specifically scientific publications. This fact makes me question the credibility of these sources, simply in that the scientific community at large seemed more skeptical and disapproving than anything else of the raw food movement. However, the reasoning behind anti-raw foodism was not always any more convincing than the pro case. The majority of the scientific articles stating that raw foods are dangerous are referring to animal-borne diseases, such as e-coli and salmonella. Since most raw foodists are also vegetarians (or even vegans) this tends not to apply. However, vegetarian foods such as unpasteurized milk and juice can harbor harmful bacteria (3), (4). Furthermore, studies have shown that even raw salad greens such as lettuce and spinach can harbor harmful bacteria due to irrigation and fertilization (2). Therefore, there is clearly a safety issue surrounding these raw foods, in that they must be free of harmful bacteria that typical sterilizing processes such as cooking would normally kill. One site in favor of raw foodism includes the caveat that "The only concern here is if you are eating traditionally raised meat which is frequently contaminated with bacteria. You will want to make sure you cook that food." Therefore, we can see that despite the pro-raw stance, there are exceptions made in order to facilitate overall dietary healthiness. Overall, I simply did not find any current articles praising the raw-foodism diet, outside of that community itself. This selective pro-raw foodism made me believe that, despite the diet's possible benefits, there couldn't be such a strong difference if no one in the scientific community at large has noticed the effects. It may be that there are serious scientific articles out there by non-members of the raw food community, and that I was simply unsuccessful in finding them. However, I searched through every seemingly relevant biology database of journal articles, magazines and studies that I could get my hands on, and the results were consistently 0 articles found for the search "raw food." The only remotely "hard science" type article I found was, while good, only linked to by one particular raw food website (5). This makes me think that, since the larger scientific community has not yet got wind of this trend, it can't possibly be as big of a deal as its advocates claim. Until the raw food movement goes under serious critical and objective analysis, I am reluctant to believe that the many claims that the body metabolizes raw foods faster/better, or that raw foods can cure diseases, are more than mere speculations and ideals of the pro-raw foodism movement. One site even claims that "a raw food diet creates major improvements [sic] in health. The reasons are not known, but the experience is unmistakable" (10) This very claim, that 'the reasons are not known,' is what I suspect to be the case behind most of the raw foodism claims. However, this is not to say that said claims are definitely false, only that they should undergo more rigorous scientific investigation. References 1)NY Times Online 2)Bugs Dress Salad, an article from the online journal nature.com 3)Eating Well: Food Safety, an article from the AARP's online index of articles 4 )Labeling Raw and Undercooked Foods, an article on public health from King County, WA 5)Raw Foods vs. Cooked Foods – Looking at the Science, a good scientific article that I found on beyondveg.com 6)Raw Food Q & A, from the rawfoodlife.com website 7)Could these foods be giving us cancer?, from The Guardian 8)The Living and Raw Foods FAQ, from Living and Raw Foods website 9)Healing Powers of Raw Food and Juice part 1, from Shirley's Wellness Café website 10)A Raw Food Diet, from Nov55 website, a "science and science criticism" site."  =

Name: skidoo | Date: January 22, 2008, 9:20
Answer: "Exposing the Myths, Dangers and Lies About Organic Food News You can Use The Latest Organic Food News This web site will prove that eating red meat and natural animal fats while restricting carbohydrates is not only healthy but will prevent and cure many diseases. Vegetarians have been brainwashed into thinking vegetarianism is a healthy way of eating. You will find on any osteoporosis, Crohn's disease, ulcerative colitis or other inflammatory bowel disease forum that 80% of the sufferers are vegetarians or ex-vegans. Yet, only 6% of the population are vegetarians. The protein deficient vegan diet will blow your guts out, cause degenerative disk disease and kill you with cancer or a hemorrhagic stroke, guaranteed."  =

Name: skidoo | Date: January 22, 2008, 9:22
Answer: From Chronic Fatigue website: ""The dangers of a Raw Food Diet” “Raw foods or cooked foods, which are healthier?” Around the world there is a new movement in nutrition which encourages people to eat a diet of exclusively raw foods avoiding any cooked food. This movement claims that raw foods are mankind’s natural diet and that a diet of all raw foods cures every disease imaginable. This movement also claims that cooked food is poison for health. This is a total MYTH. Dangers of eating only a raw food diet 1.Eating only a raw food diet is a form a food fanaticism. To obsess about eating only raw food at any cost is not only socially non-practical but also creates a neurotic mind state that fixates on food. 2. According to traditional healing systems like Ayurveda, raw foods are considered as cold in nature and harder to digest then cooked foods. This is very dangerous for people with Chronic Fatigue Syndrome, because people with CFS have a much weakened digestive system which needs nourishing, easily digestible, warming foods. Eating raw foods will simply slow down an already weakened digestion further, staving the body from absorbing the nutrients from the foods. But Ayurveda claims that fresh raw fruits are excellent to take raw and can be easily digested. 3. According to Ayurvedic Medicine when foods are not digested fully within the body they turn into toxins. This toxic residue creates countless diseases and is involved in blocking the channels within the body leading to chronic exhaustion. A diet of freshly cooked food is pre-digested by the fire of the cooking stove. This saves your body from expending energy to digest cold, hard foods like raw vegetables. 4. Raw foods are mostly tasteless with the exception of fresh fruits (which is one raw food we should eat). Where as cooked foods provide delicious taste and flavour. Human beings thrive on delicious, tasty healthy nutrition. To eat bland tasteless food causes unhappiness within the mind and body. 5. The longest living cultures on earth like the hunzakuts that live up to the age of 100-145 disease free, in prime health eat a diet of freshly cooked, natural, organic, whole foods with raw fruits. They also eat small amounts of very well cooked white organic meats. The hunzas live disease free. Cancer, heart disease, heart attacks, high or low blood pressure and childhood diseases are virtually unknown to the hunzas. The hunzas are a real life human example of what diet works, where as the raw food movement is based on theoretical ideologies, it is not time tested. 6. Raw foodists claim that within all nature man is the only creature to eat his food cooked. But god also gave man control of the element of fire. Fire is the gift from god for mankind to be used to digest and cook our food. Clearly an all raw food diet isn’t mankind’s natural diet. Short term use of a all raw food diet will not have a negative effect on most healthy people but long term an all raw food diet will weaken digestion, cause emaciation, bloating, coldness, weakness and create chronic fatigue. People with Chronic Fatigue Syndrome should avoid at all cost an all raw food diet as it’s detrimental to their health. What’s the best diet for Chronic Fatigue Syndrome? During my healing journey through Chronic Fatigue Syndrome I experimented with many diet systems these included raw food diets, vegan diets, lacto- vegetarian diets, meat eating diets, macrobiotics and others. Through such experimentation I finally found the most perfect system that explained diet in completeness. This was found in the time tested, 5000 year old healing science known as Ayurvedic Medicine. My healing diet derived from ayurvedic medicine had many vitally import elements that contributed to my healing. Firstly the diet was very digestible. Because my digestion was so weakened it was vital I ate foods I could absorb. Secondly it consisted of specific fruits, grains, proteins, vegetables, spices/herbs, fats/oils and raw sugars. These specific foods corrected the root cause of my Chronic Fatigue Syndrome which was an imbalance within my body elements known as a vata imbalance in Ayurvedic Medicine. This diet also increased my vitality and immunity. It consisted of foods that build immunity termed as ojas in Ayurvedic Medicine. This was important to nourish my cerebrospinal fluid and rejuvenate my nervous system and brain. My diet was also very energy efficient because meals were simple and quick to prepare. Another important feature of this healing diet was that it had variety and was tasty so I could stick to it long term. Author of this article Jeremy Carew-Reid is a natural healer in Ayurvedic medicine. On his website www.curechronicfatigue.com you can learn how you how you can heal Chronic Fatigue Syndrome. His website contains a wealth of free health articles on everything you need to know about healing Chronic Fatigue Syndrome. Please feel free to publish this article on your web site with the author’s resource box included and without any changes to the article. Copyright © 2004 by Jeremy Carew-Reid. "  =

Name: skidoo | Date: January 22, 2008, 9:39
Answer: Long Term Problems: A lack of the vitamins B12 and D are evident in those who practice raw foods diets. The diet can typically cause low levels of iron, protein, selenium, biotin, niacin, pantothenic acid, and zinc. The lack of these nutrients and the low caloric intake can result in low energy levels over an extended period of time, and while exercise is encouraged, followers of this diet may find that their propensity toward exercise is limited due to these low energy levels. Probably one of the biggest raw food diet dangers is the low protein levels. Low protein can result in many health problems, including the following: - Low energy levels - Bleeding gums - Muscle cramps - Edema - Reduced thyroid function - Loss of muscle - Reduced insulin secretion - Recurring infections - Gross weight loss - Thinning hair  =

Name: skidoo | Date: January 22, 2008, 9:40
Answer: Make an Informed Decision: Before you embark on a new dietary plan, regardless of whether it involves eating only raw vegetables, you should always consult your doctor. While many dietary plans profess to work miracles, in many cases you may need to modify the diet. While the basics behind a raw food diet involve eating nutritional foods, you may find that modifying the diet somewhat to include more protein and other vitamins will work better for you and your health needs. Read and research as much as you can, and then make an informed decision.  =

Name: TonyS. | Date: January 22, 2008, 20:17
Answer: I can sit here all day and pick that information apart. Heres my email one more time for anyone interested. anthony2610 At gmail.com  =

Name: AKFlyfisher | Date: January 23, 2008, 4:25
Answer: Wow, what did people eat before all the garbage/junk food we eat today, home grown vegetables, cow milk, grains, bread, oats. Eating like this will not hurt anyone, unless they are allergic. If after eating this diet for a few months, you could always have your doctor do some blood work. I am going to try this for awhile to see how I feel. I know what I am doing now isnt working. I feel better from not drinking milk now already. I have no respect for any of my previous doctors, they are all clueless about fibro and have never diagnosed anyone with it. I live in a city of over 300,000 people. Foods in grocery stores last taste and nutrients. I grew up on a farm and we had a garden and the produce in stores tastes nothing like what we buy today. Good luck to everyone wanting to stick to a healthier diet, I like prime rib, crab, fatty foods like everyone else :0) hee hee  =

Name: skidoo | Date: January 23, 2008, 8:41
Answer: AKFlyfisher...Some of my issues with TonyS' diet are that it eliminates essential food groups, it is fanatical and wil consume your life (aka salads with 21 ingredients, juicing foods, etc.), and it it is based on an unproven assumption that cooking food is bad for you (no scientific basis, only anecdotal from other raw food fanatics). I also take exception to the very biased statement that all doctors are bad. You ***will*** be going back to the olden days of the self sufficient farmer (minus that healthy cows milk and dairy products, they aren't allowed) and shun medical care -- and what was average life expectancy in those days? 45, 50? You can try the diet of the hunzakuts who live to be over 100, which includes meat and dairy in their diets and non-western work beliefs (aka, no stress) that is mentioned in one of the cut paste articles I copied, but that diet is ****very*** different from what TonyS is proposing.  =

Name: TonyS. | Date: January 23, 2008, 14:48
Answer: Being healthy and pain free is now fanatical. You heard it here first.  =

Name: skidoo | Date: January 23, 2008, 18:30
Answer: Your diet seems fanatical. What is fanatical is when one obsesses about their diet and the diet of others to the point that it consumes their life. I admit that I have made assumptions, maybe wrongly, that you are fanatical about your raw food diet based on what you posted here. From my research, the raw food movement seems a bit cultish and exclusionist (an attitude of "my way is the only way to be healthy") – maybe I am wrong to place you in this cult just as you are wrong to characterize the entire medical community as being incompetent. ----------- Here is a test from "Health Food Junkies," Dr. Steven Bratman's book on orthorexia (an obsession with food and diet to the point of fanaticism that can lead to malnutrition – not just a raw food diet, any diet that becomes a way of life causes a major life change). Dr. Bratman says if you answer yes to two or three questions, he says, you have a touch of orthorexia. Yes to four or more means you are "in trouble." If all statements apply, "you really need help. You don't have a life -- you have a menu!" (orhorexia is a real word – google it if you want to learn more). 1. Do you spend more than three hours a day thinking about and/or preparing and shopping for healthy food? (For four hours, give two points.) ……….. 2. Do you plan tomorrow's food today? ……….. 3. Do you care more about the virtue of what you eat than the pleasure you receive from eating it? ……….. 4. Have you found that as the quality of your diet has increased, the quality of your life has correspondingly diminished? ……… 5. Do you keep getting stricter with yourself? ……… 6. Do you sacrifice experiences you once enjoyed to eat the food you believe is right ?……….. 7. Do you feel an increased sense of self-esteem when you are eating healthy food? ………… 8. Do you feel guilt or self-loathing when you stray from your diet? ………. 9. Does your diet socially isolate you? ……… 10. When you are eating the way you are supposed to, do you feel a sense of total control? …………  =

Name: skidoo | Date: January 24, 2008, 9:38
Answer: From beyondveg.com website, summary of article titled “Is Cooked Food Poison? Looking at the Science on Raw vs. Cooked Foods” by Jean-Louis Tu ******* ----- Vitamin and mineral content in raw vs. cooked foods. The vitamin content of raw foods is higher than cooked foods, though by relatively modest amounts that appear to range from (roughly) 10-25% greater in most cases. The difference in mineral content between raw and cooked foods appears to be negligible. (Cooking itself does not appear to compromise mineral content. However, when water is used in cooking, there may be a small amount of leaching of minerals into the water.) ----- Cooking can increase bioavailability of some nutrients. As discussed in earlier sections, conservative cooking greatly increases the bioavailability/digestibility of starch. Bioavailability of beta-carotene can be very low from raw vegetables such as carrots, but is improved by steaming. Some proteins are better assimilated after cooking, although digestibility of others may be negatively impacted somewhat. Cooking also neutralizes many antinutrients and thereby may increase the bioavailability of a number of minerals (e.g., zinc, iron) in many plant foods. ----- Cooking creates some toxins, neutralizes others. All plants contain at least some amount of "nature's pesticides." There is no such thing as a toxin-free diet. Within a normal range of consumption, toxins resulting from conservative cooking techniques can be safely handled by the body's normal mechanisms, and do not seem to increase the incidence of degenerative diseases. ----- There are no known all-raw or, apparently, with the possible lone exception of a few Inuit groups, even predominantly raw cultures on the planet, including the healthiest traditional cultures, and including the most primitive of hunter-gatherers. Note: The Inuit ("Eskimos"), to whom legend has often attributed the eating of all of their meat raw, were found upon early or first contacts by the noted explorer Stefansson and other fellow explorers to eat some fat (i.e., blubber) raw; and some groups ate large amounts (though not all) meat raw; but other groups cooked much if not most of their meat. ----- Use of fire goes back tens if not hundreds of thousands of years into prehistory. The most reliable evidence suggests that fire was initially controlled by humans (for warmth and protection against predators) approximately 400,000-500,000 years ago, with widespread cooking having been practiced for at least the last 40,000 years, possibly longer. ----- Substituting cooked starches for overly high fruit consumption improves the diet. Including cooked vegetables and/or starches considerably improves the nutrient profile of a (vegetarian) raw-food diet that predominates in fruits, which although abundant in phytochemicals and in certain select vitamins (C, B-6, nicotinamide, potassium), are on the whole low in vitamins and minerals overall (particularly vitamin D, B-12, biotin, calcium), and high in sugar. ----- Long-term success on all-raw vegan diets is rare. While increasing the percentage of raw-food in the diet appears to improve the health of people who have been eating the standard Western diet, few people, even the most enthusiastic of adherents, have been able to maintain an all-raw-food diet over the long term, and for more than simply social pressures. Among those who have, there is a high prevalence of emaciation. ----- Most people who eat vegetarian diets maintain better health over the long term when including a portion of cooked foods compared to going all-raw. ************In the end, as with many other dietary issues, the question of raw vs. cooked foods comes down to idealism vs. realism. Which is more important: maintaining a philosophy--or maintaining your health? That's the bottom line.****  =

Name: AKFlyfisher | Date: January 24, 2008, 11:29
Answer: Skidoo Not trying to start an agrument here, but I am going to try this type of diet for a few months. I have IBS pretty bad, and I know my food isnt digesting all the way, it doesnt stay in my system long enough. I have read some articles that steaming vegetables and eating soups from a crock pot helps people with digesting things and allows the body to absorb vitamins better. Hey after living in a city for 10 years, I wish I could go back to a farm life with foods right from a garden and a lot less stress. Based on all the articles you have posted, have you found a way of eating that works for you? Have you had to eliminate some foods? I know chocolate bothers me, and latte's which I love but am quiting as it triggers my IBS. I read in this forum treatment sections that the supplement SAM-E may help people, I have not tried that one. Since this neurontin isnt working for me, I am going to try the lyrica. My walking helps a little, but I may bight the bullet and get into a pilates class. God Bless  =

Name: skidoo | Date: January 24, 2008, 14:08
Answer: AKFlyfisher - The farm diet you are referring to is very different from the raw food only diet that Tony has described above. Did he e-mail you something different than the all raw food diet? He is saying to eat only raw fruits, vegetables and grains and also says no animal products including dairy. Dairy, eggs, and meats are staples of a farm diet, and so is cooking (often over-cooking) so I am confused what diet you are speaking of. As for me, I am all for moderation, having a well balanced diet that includes cooked and raw fruits and vegetables, cooked meats, dairy, and eggs. After some recent research, I must say I will be very cautious now with organic foods as these tend to use organic (i.e. animal manure) fertilizers that have caused some recent outreaks for illnesses. Keep in mind that food is not the only causative agent for IBS. There are food trggers (you are right to stay away from caffiene and chocolate) but IBS can also be stress related and is a common side effect of fibromyalgia.  =

Name: lmb2 | Date: January 24, 2008, 15:49
Answer: There are studies that show that IBS is very often related to low levels of serotonin, and people with fibro often have lower levels of serotonin than others. There is actually more serotonin in the stomach than in the brain and it helps your stomach to digest foods. The studies show that a big reason a lot of fibro sufferers end up with IBS is because of these lower levels of serotonin. If your IBS is extremely bad, you might ask your doc about some meds that can help your body produce more serotonin or add it, there are a few things you could try. All raw food is actually proven to be harder to digest, so be careful. good luck :)  =

Name: islandguy | Date: January 24, 2008, 22:24
Answer: Skidoo, it is always nice to know that people like you and I don't let miracle cures get our hopes too high for the be all/cure all. Fibromyalgia has no cure. The cause is unknown as is the cure. If there was a cure or a method to control the pain that all sufferers have on a day to day basis...one would be marketing it in a fashion to go to the bank on a daily basis. What works for some...does not work for others. One should not sell their "feeling better" methods to the point that it offends others. TonyS. ....``we get it.`` If any persons would like to try your method......so be it. It is not wrong....but don't hang a carrot at the end of the pole. False hope is always wrong....All the luck to those that try this....it just isn`t giving me much hope as ``I`ve been there ....done that.......````  =

Name: skidoo | Date: January 25, 2008, 17:19
Answer: More on cooked vs raw food from diagnose me.com: The contentious question often arises: "Raw versus Cooked: Which is More Natural?" Those advocating a "raw foodist" lifestyle tend to argue that cooking is unnatural. They often argue that since we evolved eating raw foods like the rest of the animal kingdom, we are better adapted to eat that way. In a landmark article published October, 2003, however, two Harvard anthropologists argue just the opposite. [Comparative Biology and Physiology 136 (2003): p.35] First, they note that other than the new deliberate "raw foodists", there do not seem to be any current or historical populations, small groups or even individuals living for more than a few days without access to cooked foods. Then they take on the belief that cooking is a recent phenomenon for our species. Mammalian species like ourselves can evolve adaptations in as few as 5000 years. Human beings have been cooking for at least 250,000 years, and perhaps as long as 1.9 million years - long before we were even Homo sapiens. They argue that not only have humans adapted to eating cooked foods, they argue that human beings have adapted so much that eating cooked food now seems obligatory for optimum health. Indeed, medical literature seems to back them up in several respects. One of the few studies (and possibly the only study) of 100% raw foodists followed for years [Annals of Nutrition and Metabolism 43 (1999): p.69] showed that a third of the raw foodists were suffering from Chronic Energy Deficiency. Many were literally "wasting away". Most of the women suffered menstrual irregularities and half of the women lost their menstrual periods altogether, which could lead to devastating osteoporosis. Further, the sample consisted of modern urban people with relatively low activity levels who had access to high-quality, high-calorie produce from around the world year-round. How might our nontropical hunter-gatherer ancestors have lived through a single winter without cooking, especially with their extreme energy expenditure? There have been major changes in our digestive biology over the past few hundred thousand years, and the researchers argue that these changes may have been due to the availability of cooked foods. 100,000 years ago, for example, the size of our jaws and molar teeth started to shrink, perhaps as an adaptation to softer, more easily-chewed cooked foods. They also suggest that perhaps other differences between our digestive systems and those of the great apes may also have been because of our adaptation to cooked foods - our smaller gut volume, longer small intestine, smaller colon, and faster gut passage rate. They conclude that while well-supported individuals in an urban environment with a relatively sedentary lifestyle may be able to thrive on a raw food diet, it is neither natural nor necessarily desirable for optimal health.  =

Name: skidoo | Date: January 25, 2008, 17:22
Answer: lmb2 -- good point about raw foods aggravating IBS. That is why it is dangerous to go on a fad diet without some direction from the medical community. What works for some not only doesn't always work for others, but can actually be dangerous to others.  =

Name: skidoo | Date: January 25, 2008, 17:30
Answer: islandguy - you said "If there was a cure or a method to control the pain that all sufferers have on a day to day basis...one would be marketing it in a fashion to go to the bank on a daily basis." You hit the nail on the head. And at a minimum, scientists would be studying it. One of the documents I mentioned above stated that they were unable to find any studies on raw food diets in any credible peer reviewed scientific or medical journals, so all claims of this type of diet must be met with skepticism. Much of the claims are anecdotal (this is what happened to me) and based on only relatively short term experience on the diet (TonyS says he is only 24 so he can't have been on the diet very long himself --).  =

Name: TonyS. | Date: January 25, 2008, 23:57
Answer: Diagnose me.com? Haha are you kidding? I dont care who diagnoses what. If you have pain, you can get rid of it. You can see what these guys do all day long. They sit here, and try to tell you why things are wrong. Total negativity. Im here for positivity, and will help you get on the right path to health. Ask anyone Ive talked to. anthony2610 AT gmail.com  =

Name: TonyS. | Date: January 26, 2008, 0:12
Answer: Damn near everything thats been said here, as far as live foods, is not correct. We have doctors to back us up, as well. Everyone listen to doctors, so you have to have a few. I have vitamin levels higher than anyone here, and will always be that way.  =

Name: TonyS. | Date: January 26, 2008, 0:19
Answer: Also, everything this joker says about raw foodists, can be said for anyone. Doctors have long diagnosed people with food addictions. This does not happen with live foods. You eat to live, not live to eat. Food addictions do not happen when you eat live foods. If you feel you cant eat a salad, because you are so addicted to cooked food, then you have alot more going on than just diet. If it feels good, do it. If it tastes good, eat it. Youre an addict. Just like any user.  =

Name: skidoo | Date: January 26, 2008, 10:16
Answer: The following should be consumed with caution: Buckwheat greens are toxic when raw, particularly if juiced or eaten in large quantities by fair skinned individuals. The chemical component fagopyrum is known to cause severe photosensitivity and other dermatological complaints.... Kidney beans, including sprouts, are toxic when raw....... Rhubarb: when eaten in sufficient quantity, leaves can be toxic when raw, stalks are completely safe to eat when harvested early. ..... Potatoes: a member of the nightshade family, can produce the toxic alkaloid solanine. The flesh of the potato just beneath the skins is usually green if solanine is present, but one may be present without the other. Solanine can be removed by peeling the potatoes, or neutralized by cooking in a deep fryer. In processed potatoes such as chips and fries, there is little hazard since peels are removed and they are fried....... Raw foods contain bacteria and may contain parasites, which may cause foodborne illnesses. Washing properly according to Health Department or common sense will cleanse the food properly along with proper storage.  =

Name: skidoo | Date: January 26, 2008, 10:22
Answer: A 2005 study has shown that a raw food vegetarian diet is associated with a lower bone density. Reference: Fontana L, Shew JL, Holloszy JO, Villareal DT. Low bone mass in subjects on a long-term raw vegetarian diet. Arch Intern Med. 2005 Mar 28;165(6):684-9.  =

Name: skidoo | Date: January 26, 2008, 10:24
Answer: One study of raw veganism shows amenorrhea and underweightness in women. Reference: Koebnick C, Strassner C, Hoffmann I, Leitzmann C. Consequences of a long-term raw food diet on body weight and menstruation: results of a questionnaire survey. Ann Nutr Metab. 1999;43(2):69-79  =

Name: skidoo | Date: January 26, 2008, 10:25
Answer: Problems with increased risk of dental erosion with raw food diets is documented in: Ganss C, Schlechtriemen M, Klimek J. Dental erosions in subjects living on a raw food diet. Caries Res. 1999;33(1):74-80.  =

Name: skidoo | Date: January 26, 2008, 10:39
Answer: The quote from Mark Anthony, PhD, in his article titled "Nutrition Beyond the Trends: The Raw Truth" pretty much sums up my feelings on this issue. "Raw food is great and, I would argue, an irreplaceable part of a healthy diet... But when the discussion changes from the benefits of raw food to the evils of cooking, we’ve left promoting health far behind and ventured into the shaky realm of selling a pseudo philosophy." My issue is not with raw foods but with a 100% raw food vegan diet being healthy. Also from Dr. Anthony's article and about cooking foods: "Some foods are only able to be properly digested when cooked. Legumes contain an inhibitor that counters trypsin, a protein-digesting enzyme in the small intestines. Heating destroys that inhibitor and thus increases the protein quality of the legumes. Legumes also contain phytic acid, which can bind minerals and make them less available. There are many ways to stop the actions of phytic acid: soaking, germination, fermentation and cooking. Also, only cooking has the added advantage of gelatinizing the starch, which makes it more digestible. We obtain far more energy from starches (grains, beans, and potatoes) when they’re heated and allowed to gelatinize. The inability to fully access the calories in starch makes it difficult for raw foodists to hold body weight and strength. That’s one reason for the weight loss in an all-raw diet. A “raw only” eater is also at risk for muscle loss, because it’s difficult to store muscle glycogen effectively on such a diet."  =

Name: TonyS. | Date: January 26, 2008, 12:49
Answer: Ive been able to gain 14 lbs of lean muscle mass in 90 days, and have energy like I had when I was a kid. Also, I've enjoyed the sprouts you say are "toxic". Wheatgrass is very detoxifying, and I've seen people have problems with it, just as I've seen people have problems with garlic. I've eaten sprouted kidney beans many times. I've had all those items on many occasions.  =

Name: skidoo | Date: January 26, 2008, 13:04
Answer: Did you really research this like you said? I think you are treading on very dangerous ground and I urge anyone to carefully research any diet before blinding following it. TonyS, Try doing a google internet search and use the words "kidney bean sprouts toxic". Most of the hits are from raw food supporting websites that confirm this fact. This is from one such site: "Soy and kidney bean sprouts are toxic and should be avoided. Lentils, black eyed beans, partridge peas, peanuts and vetch all have high levels of enzyme inhibitors which cause poor digestion and gas. Alfalfa sprouts are mildly toxic – do not eat them every day, and avoid them if you are a cancer patient, have a weak immune system or suffer from inflammation. Most raw sprouts contain hemagglutinins, which inhibit the absorption of proteins and fats. The worst are soybeans and kidney beans, followed by Pinto, Navy, Black eye, Lima, Black beans, Aduki beans, lentils and peas Hemagglutinins are destroyed by cooking. Some people are more sensitive to raw sprouted legumes, and need to cook them. This is no reason to avoid the nutritious and enzyme-rich sprouts of other seeds." growyouthful.com/sprouts.php  =

Name: TonyS. | Date: January 26, 2008, 22:30
Answer: Yes, I have. Ive eaten alfalfa sprouts regularly, for years. (and adzuki, lentils) If you have been eating raw foods at a high rate, these things dont apply. Wheatgrass does not bother me, at all. Nothing from the rhubard plant effects me, at all. Enzyme inhibition is a problem, if you already have digestive issues, which most people do. Ive talked to my doctor about this, more than once. If youve been eating alot of processed foods, then yes, you are going to have problems. Some doctors live by it, some sa